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Post subject: Looks like it is going to turn ugly.
 Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 01:18 AM
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Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 02:16 AM
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Posts: 16181
Location: Jaw Jah
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It's always been ugly. We've had about 10 Presidents
who were shot. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 02:40 AM
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Location: ohhhh here and there
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| Sheesh... |
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~When Words Are Not Enough~
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 03:25 AM
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Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| I, for one am going to be on the look out for strange floating sheet with legs that just might decide to visit the voting areas. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 03:32 AM
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Posts: 4472
Location: Outer Space ;)
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There was even a plot to assassinate Bill at one point. This is probably one of many, and just the only one we've heard of *so far*.  |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 03:36 AM
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Posts: 16181
Location: Jaw Jah
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| SMB wrote: | | I, for one am going to be on the look out for strange floating sheet with legs that just might decide to visit the voting areas. |
I do worry about you sometimes. Seems you've been
trained to see things that aren't always there  |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 03:43 AM
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Posts: 4472
Location: Outer Space ;)
Status: Offline
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| Gornman wrote: | | SMB wrote: | | I, for one am going to be on the look out for strange floating sheet with legs that just might decide to visit the voting areas. |
I do worry about you sometimes. Seems you've been
trained to see things that aren't always there |
Might see that in ID.  |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 02:12 PM
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Posts: 14792
Location: second star to the right
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| I read that this morning. I guess we'll never completely get over our ignorance. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 04:39 PM
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Posts: 1746
Location: Lakeland Florida
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I've been expecting things like this.
When Obama was announced as a candidate months ago, the racists were up in arms. There has been talk of assassinating him for several months now. During McCain's (and especially Palin's) rallies, people were calling for the death of Obama. At one rally, McCain even tried to calm the people down, and he was booed!
America is one of the most racist nations in the world, but most people do not get this. In fact, it is a positive sign that anyone with recent African ancestors actually is running for president!!! |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 05:57 PM
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Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling..... 
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 06:53 PM
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Joined: Feb 02, 2003
Posts: 4380
Location: Walthamstow
Status: Offline
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| rdb wrote: | I've been expecting things like this.
America is one of the most racist nations in the world, but most people do not get this. In fact, it is a positive sign that anyone with recent African ancestors actually is running for president!!! |
Sorry rdb but that is a terrible and wrong thing to say. I have never encountered any racism in my time there and having married into an American family have never felt anything but welcome. Sure there will be instances of racism but any more so than Spain, a country that until very recently still had a fascist government? |
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When I was a child, my dad tried to force-feed me.
After a while, my mum said, "Just use a spoon, Mike. You're not a Jedi."
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 09:48 PM
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Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| Cat wrote: | Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling.....
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
Cat, Please leave me out of your response to Bob. We are two different people with two different views.
I merely posted a news report. I never indicated that the US was the most racist country. I do not appreciate your indicating that my views are identical to my husband's. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 11:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 30, 2005
Posts: 16181
Location: Jaw Jah
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| SMB wrote: | | Cat wrote: | Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling.....
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
Cat, Please leave me out of your response to Bob. We are two different people with two different views.
I merely posted a news report. I never indicated that the US was the most racist country. I do not appreciate your indicating that my views are identical to my husband's. |
What am I? chopped liver?...I don't rate a kick in the a##?....LOL  |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 28, 2008 - 11:44 PM
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Joined: Sep 18, 2004
Posts: 7329
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| SMB wrote: | | Cat wrote: | Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling.....
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
Cat, Please leave me out of your response to Bob. We are two different people with two different views.
I merely posted a news report. I never indicated that the US was the most racist country. I do not appreciate your indicating that my views are identical to my husband's. |
Sorry, Sue, but I was also thinking about your comment about possible harassment at the polls by clan members, but perhaps you were joking? It's pretty hard to tell a person's intentions when you can't see their faces.
Of course I know you and Bob are different people, and didn't mean to lump you together, just because of wedded bliss......
And when I talk of emigrating, to me that's not a bad thing. Over half the people I know have emigrated to, or from, this country, and if people don't feel very positive about where they are living, then finding a place, across town, across the country, or in another country, seems to be a very good option. Life's just too short for anything less than being happy. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 12:04 AM
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Hopefully this thread isn't headed down the toilet. That's Vito's forte.
Sue, if I remember correctly, don't you and Bob face prejudice because both of you are native Americans? Sorry to be nosy but I thought I'd ask.
If the question offends you, I will edit this post. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 12:08 AM
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Member
Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| Gornman wrote: | | SMB wrote: | | Cat wrote: | Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling.....
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
Cat, Please leave me out of your response to Bob. We are two different people with two different views.
I merely posted a news report. I never indicated that the US was the most racist country. I do not appreciate your indicating that my views are identical to my husband's. |
What am I? chopped liver?...I don't rate a kick in the a##?....LOL |
No, you are lizard liver  plus you have to remember that we were ready to vote a Gorn lizard into office. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 12:20 AM
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Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| Cat wrote: | | SMB wrote: | | Cat wrote: | Bob and Sue, you seem to feel this is a very racist country. A rather negative view to say the least.
I've traveled, and lived in other countries, and believe me, the US is by far not the most racist. I think you have had limited exposure to other cultures, which is why you view it this way. I think you'd be pretty shocked if you did some travelling.....
If you really feel the US is that bad, have you considered emigrating to another country that you might feel is better? |
Cat, Please leave me out of your response to Bob. We are two different people with two different views.
I merely posted a news report. I never indicated that the US was the most racist country. I do not appreciate your indicating that my views are identical to my husband's. |
Sorry, Sue, but I was also thinking about your comment about possible harassment at the polls by clan members, but perhaps you were joking? It's pretty hard to tell a person's intentions when you can't see their faces.
Of course I know you and Bob are different people, and didn't mean to lump you together, just because of wedded bliss......
And when I talk of emigrating, to me that's not a bad thing. Over half the people I know have emigrated to, or from, this country, and if people don't feel very positive about where they are living, then finding a place, across town, across the country, or in another country, seems to be a very good option. Life's just too short for anything less than being happy. |
I was half way joking, but that is why I posted the other question about Obama signs being torn down. While we seem to have come a long way toward healing issues about racism and predudices, there are times when it is clear that there is a group out there sort of flying under the radar. Those are the folks that concern me. I can remember a tme when black people were harrassed at the poles and often discouraged from voting. I can also remember getting harrassed myself years ago because I was a registered Republican voting in a predominately Democratic town. Now things seem to be the reverse.
Just call it an old lady's gut feeling, but I am very concerned about the safety of Obama. I am concerned that his security team wasn't even informed of the attempted plot. That, to me is a bit scarry and even if it was rapidly gotten under control.
Oh well, truce and peace to all. Bob is home now. Be nice. He is a big, rough tough marshmellow with a heart of gold who gets overly passionate sometimes. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 12:24 AM
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Member
Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| Mirizor wrote: | Hopefully this thread isn't headed down the toilet. That's Vito's forte.
Sue, if I remember correctly, don't you and Bob face prejudice because both of you are native Americans? Sorry to be nosy but I thought I'd ask.
If the question offends you, I will edit this post. |
Not offended in the least. I have never thought of it as prejudice so much as a difference in mindsets and how we think differently about things. Looking at it that way, I just accept, or try to accept folks from where they are coming from.
As for the thread going down the toilet, I don't think so. We are probably giving any new comers some entertainment in watching a cyber brawl and then a trip to the cafe for a cool down drink.
Perhaps we should invite Bill and George to come along.  |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 01:24 AM
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Joined: Oct 13, 2005
Posts: 1746
Location: Lakeland Florida
Status: Offline
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| Mirizor wrote: | Hopefully this thread isn't headed down the toilet. That's Vito's forte.
Sue, if I remember correctly, don't you and Bob face prejudice because both of you are native Americans? Sorry to be nosy but I thought I'd ask.
If the question offends you, I will edit this post. |
Rather than give examples, I think it can be summed up that yes, we've faced persecution and discrimination. It's cost us and caused us a lot of harm.
Actually, I'm glad you asked. People tend to think that discrimination isn't a modern phenomena, but something that happened in the past. If you study race and racial issues (as I have), you learn just how pervasive racism and discrimination are to this day. The problem is, most people don't see it.
A good video to demonstrate this fact is "The Color of Fear". It's a bit dated (I think made in the early 90's), but still very valid and instructive.
There are also several good books out there on racism. Two Nations by Andrew Hacker is highly recommended , as well as Racist America by Joe R. Feagin (This one is a bit hard to read and I don't like the way it was written, but it's still good concerning the topic of racism). Failing Grades by H. Roy Kaplin is a good third book- it's focused more on a method of dealing with conflict problems in schools, but a good portion of the book deals with racism. Also, Tim Wise ( http://www.timwise.org/ and http://www.alternet.org/authors/4152/ ) has several essays on race that are valid and worth reading. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 01:44 AM
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Joined: Aug 30, 2005
Posts: 16181
Location: Jaw Jah
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| rdb wrote: |
Rather than give examples, I think it can be summed up that yes, we've faced persecution and discrimination. It's cost us and caused us a lot of harm.
Actually, I'm glad you asked. People tend to think that discrimination isn't a modern phenomena, but something that happened in the past. If you study race and racial issues (as I have), you learn just how pervasive racism and discrimination are to this day. The problem is, most people don't see it.
A good video to demonstrate this fact is "The Color of Fear". It's a bit dated (I think made in the early 90's), but still very valid and instructive.
There are also several good books out there on racism. Two Nations by Andrew Hacker is highly recommended , as well as Racist America by Joe R. Feagin (This one is a bit hard to read and I don't like the way it was written, but it's still good concerning the topic of racism). Failing Grades by H. Roy Kaplin is a good third book- it's focused more on a method of dealing with conflict problems in schools, but a good portion of the book deals with racism. Also, Tim Wise ( http://www.timwise.org/ and http://www.alternet.org/authors/4152/ ) has several essays on race that are valid and worth reading. |
All right, let's have this conversation here, maybe it will help, it
sure as hell can't be had in the public domain, because the "race card"
is immediately brought out and all common sense goes away.
First, I must post my credentials. I shouldn't have to, but that's
part of the PC world we live in
I went to the public schools with blacks, many of my friends went to
the private schools, they are allowed. I was the only white boy on the
high school basketball team, I have a picture around somewhere if you need proof.
My neighbors are black, my mother preaches at a church with many
blacks in attendance.
Why do I even have to go to this effort to prove myself?
Get it?
I take people one at a time.
If you are an a##hole and are black, you are still an a##hole.
The same goes if you are white, indian, asian....etc...
If we can't agree that racism exists in every country, in every culture,
in every race, and not just the USA, we have absolutely no foundation for discussion. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 03:21 AM
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Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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Race is a socially constructed concept based upon domination.
Frankly, I am proud to call myself a member of the race of humans.
Because everyone knows that we are far better than the Klingons. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 03:30 AM
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Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| Cuzsis wrote: | | There was even a plot to assassinate Bill at one point. This is probably one of many, and just the only one we've heard of *so far*. |
There was once plot to kill Elvis also. The East Germans thought he was some sort of secret weapon for the Army. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 05:52 AM
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Joined: Aug 30, 2005
Posts: 16181
Location: Jaw Jah
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| SMB wrote: | Race is a socially constructed concept based upon domination.
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And I always thought you popped out of your mama's belly
and you were what you were |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 06:13 AM
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Posts: 5884
Location: Midwest
Status: Offline
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Racism is an ugly thing.
Racism against blacks. Racism against whites.
It's sadly alive and well in this world, including the U.S.
But what also is ugly to me, are people who use something genuinely appalling like racism to serve their own ends. People like Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and others have made a living out of it.
I don't give a crap what your skin color is. If you're a good person, you're a good person.
I don't give a crap if Barack Obama is white, black, purple or green. I don't like his politics and question things like his judgement and his character.
If someone is going to not vote for him solely because he's black, that's racism and appalling.
If someone is going to vote for him because "it's time for a black President" and that alone, that's racism and appalling.
Somebody posted this on a place I frequent:
"'Rosa sat so Martin could walk. Martin walked so Obama could run. Obama ran so our children can fly.' Wow!"
I kept my mouth shut, but I wanted to reply something like "Give me a f#$@ing break. That's a bit much, don't you think?"
Obama becoming the first black president is "historic", but just because he's black and close to becoming President doesn't automatically instill some greatness in him that will let "our children fly".
Let's see what he actually DOES. If he makes the country a better place, great. If he gets through his socialist views and proves his dedication to 'bipartisanship' and 'change' is just a bunch of honey-soaked babble....I don't think he'll get re-elected.
I'm totally rambling. But as someone who isn't the slight bit racist, I find it sickening when race, a real problem, is used as an excuse or a trump card to discount what other people think/say. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Oct 29, 2008 - 07:07 AM
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Member
Joined: Feb 12, 2005
Posts: 14327
Location: Your daily life is your temple and your religion. Kahil Gibran
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| AquinasWI wrote: | Racism is an ugly thing.
Racism against blacks. Racism against whites.
It's sadly alive and well in this world, including the U.S.
But what also is ugly to me, are people who use something genuinely appalling like racism to serve their own ends. People like Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and others have made a living out of it.
I don't give a crap what your skin color is. If you're a good person, you're a good person.
I don't give a crap if Barack Obama is white, black, purple or green. I don't like his politics and question things like his judgement and his character.
If someone is going to not vote for him solely because he's black, that's racism and appalling.
If someone is going to vote for him because "it's time for a black President" and that alone, that's racism and appalling.
Somebody posted this on a place I frequent:
"'Rosa sat so Martin could walk. Martin walked so Obama could run. Obama ran so our children can fly.' Wow!"
I kept my mouth shut, but I wanted to reply something like "Give me a f#$@ing break. That's a bit much, don't you think?"
Obama becoming the first black president is "historic", but just because he's black and close to becoming President doesn't automatically instill some greatness in him that will let "our children fly".
Let's see what he actually DOES. If he makes the country a better place, great. If he gets through his socialist views and proves his dedication to 'bipartisanship' and 'change' is just a bunch of honey-soaked babble....I don't think he'll get re-elected.
I'm totally rambling. But as someone who isn't the slight bit racist, I find it sickening when race, a real problem, is used as an excuse or a trump card to discount what other people think/say. |
Good points. I have never used the "race" card for any successes or failures in my life.
To add to what you posted, there are those who will refuse to vote for Obama because he is black and that is just as bad, just as there are those who will not vote for McCain because his running mate is a woman.
This is clearly one of those times when citizens need to do their homework and know what the issues are, what is at stake and what each candidate brings to the table for solving the issues before voting. |
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